I'm Choked! OverPaying for Duty + taxes + broker fees on Lens Shipped From Japan

[braxus]

{Moderator Note - thread title tweaked}

I needed to rebuy a bunch of lenses for a system I sold off a year or so ago. I started with one this week that cost $99 US dollars, which with exchange is $143. With shipping I paid a total of $204 Canadian. So it was sent to me via DHL Express from Japan. So today I get the customs payment request and its asking me to pay a whopping $167 Canadian before they'll clear it. That is more then the lens actually cost! WTF? How the heck can duty add up to this much, and I dont believe even the tarrifs would cost that much?! Does anyone know why my duty is more then the item itself? I sent a heated letter to the seller asking him why and threatened to have it returned to sender for a full refund.

 

[Pieter12]

I needed to rebuy a bunch of lenses for a system I sold off a year or so ago. I started with one this week that cost $99 US dollars, which with exchange is $143. With shipping I paid a total of $204 Canadian. So it was sent to me via DHL Express from Japan. So today I get the customs payment request and its asking me to pay a whopping $167 Canadian before they'll clear it. That is more then the lens actually cost! WTF? How the heck can duty add up to this much, and I dont believe even the tarrifs would cost that much. Does anyone know why my duty is more then the item itself? I sent a heated letter to the seller asking him why and threatened to have it returned to sender for a full refund.

Have you tried contacting DHL in Canada? They may be able to explain why the duty is so high.

 

[BradS]

I dunno but I think I'd ask seller for a full refund and let him deal with DHL ... and make sure to request FedEx or Japan Post next time.
DHL are, in my experience, uh, not good.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

DHL not only ships your item, but acts as customs broker...and they charge a fee for this. Whenever DHL or UPS is cited as the shipper, I run.

 

[braxus]

Have you tried contacting DHL in Canada? They may be able to explain why the duty is so high.

I did but they closed before I could call them today.

Andy- I've never paid more for duty on anything than what its worth. DHL in the past only charged no more then 30-50 total on lenses. Its never been in the hundreds.

 

[BrianShaw]

It’s a completely new and confusing world regarding international purchases. Sorry to hear about your troubles. I’ve curtailed international purchases until the situation settles.

 

[mshchem]

I've had issues before buying from small dealers in Japan (here in USA) I've found it's usually how the seller classified the item. Doubtful you'll get very far with DHL, worth a try. Stinks because Japan dealers have wonderful things.

 

[MattKing]

You need to obtain a breakdown of the amount claimed.
You need to know what value for duty they used - which includes shipping costs - and what country of origin they used for the duty calculation - he duty rate is based on the country of origin for the lens, not the country you purchased it from.
How much of this is duty, how much is customs brokerage fee, how much is GST and how much is PST?
I'm not sure whether or not the GST and PST are charged on the customs brokerage fee - one or both may be.
If the lens is a medium format lens manufactured in Japan - my guess - than I believe that such lenses are entitled to be processed as a duty free import under the MFN tariff code 9002.11.10 - but that should be checked.
But remember, duty free does not mean free to import.

 

[MattKing]

I've had issues before buying from small dealers in Japan (here in USA) I've found it's usually how the seller classified the item. Doubtful you'll get very far with DHL, worth a try. Stinks because Japan dealers have wonderful things.

Yes. If the dealer in Japan filled out the export documents incorrectly, it can have a huge effect on the duty charged.

 

[radialMelt]

In addition to the above, know that you can ask to do the customs brokerage yourself, and thus save yourself the sometimes exorbitant fees that DHL and UPS (and others) charge for their brokerage services. You'll have to phone them and inform them you want to do that. You'll then have to go to where the shipments come in for customs clearance - probably the airport, depending on where you live - to sign some papers and declare value and pay appropriate import tax, which is just your provincial sales tax, and then take your item home.

 

[Marcelo Paniagua]

Same experience with DHL and ítems from Japan. Returned item. Seller was a complete gentleman and was quite understanding.

Duty was about 150% of item price. Item was delivered on México so a global issue.

 

[OAPOli]

That's unusual. You should have to pay HST + the brokerage fee ($10-15). You should be able to get a receipt with more details.

 

[Hassasin]

Any service outside of Japan post/ems will cost you even if there are zero actual custom duties. Couriers charge exorbitant fees for so called custom processing even if there are no duties to be paid. If a Japanese seller does not guarantee me ems shipment I don’t buy.

In your case I don’t see a return option unless they seller is super nice. They all have duty clause on their page.

 

[braxus]

He's looking into it with DHL. I think he realizes the duty charge is too much.

 

[braxus]

I looked myself. They are charging $17 for broker fee and $148.30 for the taxes owing. Based on the taxes charged, the declared value would have been $1235.10 Canadian dollars, not the $143 I paid. Somewhere he screwed up.

 

[Hassasin]

The value may well be a „book value” which Canadian customs may be using

 

[braxus]

When it was new maybe, but this is not a new lens. There is no way they'd value this lens at over 1200 today.

 

[gorbas]

I just noticed that after Canada post strike, they start charging Duty, GST, PST and Handling fees for items that before strike would be delivered without any charges.
EMS from Japan used to be super fast and with out any extra fees. UPS, FedEx and DHL always used to charge me as much as possible.

 

[F4U]

Let's see... "Duty" as I understand it, is simply for a duty official to open an package and check for drugs, non-domestic invasive animal or plant species, or dangerous contraband, whereupon the package is re-sealed and re-injected into the shipping process. Unless the bureau that employs these people become bloated with excess personnel, there would be no reason to inflate the cost beyond that. Something is amiss with these figures.

 

[gordrob]

DHL not only ships your item, but acts as customs broker...and they charge a fee for this. Whenever DHL or UPS is cited as the shipper, I run.

Same as Andrew when I see DHL or UPS is involved. I mailed a parcel to the USA yesterday and when it got to the Canada Post processing plant I got a notice "Delivery may be delayed due to public authority". I have no idea what this means but probably the recipient is going to have to wait for it to be delivered.

 

[F4U]

My buying policy is frugality first. If something is not already in the US, I don't need it as bad as I thought, so I don't buy it. Tomorrow is another day, and i might well wake up tomorrow of another mind. Right now my financial situstion is bit more secure than previously. But hearkenng back not long ago, there was a stretch of many years when I considered a package of store-brand oatmeal cookies as a bi-yearly $1 frivolity. Those days scarred me, yet made me strong. Do I need another piece of gear now? Not hardly. Just say no.You'd be surprised how quick you forget about it. Another one even better will pop up someday. Many times for free.

 

[koraks]

When it was new maybe, but this is not a new lens. There is no way they'd value this lens at over 1200 today.

It's not so much about any real valuation of the lens as such. DHL won't inspect it to that level of detail. They will use standard item values for broader categories; your lens may have been categorized as a "precision optical item" or "camera equipment" and DHL would have a default value for that. That value won't relate to the actual item's original list price, current resale value etc. in any way. It's just an accounting 'reality'. This sort of problem can occur if the sender fails to declare the value properly, which is necessary in order to prevent the clearance office from having to do the valuation themselves, which will virtually always be to the disadvantage of the buyer.
One more thing to take into account, although it makes only a relatively small difference, is that the taxes may be calculated over the item price plus shipping cost.

My buying policy is frugality first. If something is not already in the US, I don't need it as bad as I thought, so I don't buy it.

That's very nice, but some of us (1) do want a certain piece of kit sometimes and (2) don't all live in a place with a large internal market (from a tax perspective). In those cases, imports are just a fact of life.

 

[MattKing]

Let's see... "Duty" as I understand it, is simply for a duty official to open an package and check for drugs, non-domestic invasive animal or plant species, or dangerous contraband, whereupon the package is re-sealed and re-injected into the shipping process. Unless the bureau that employs these people become bloated with excess personnel, there would be no reason to inflate the cost beyond that. Something is amiss with these figures.

Duty is the tax charged on imports. Prior to income tax, it was the largest source of revenue for fledging governments.
It remains a meaningful source of revenue.
In modern times, when applied fairly, duty rates are used to adjust for all sorts market unfairness.

 

[koraks]

In modern times, when applied fairly, duty rates are used to adjust for all sorts market unfairness.

Note that we have to distinguish between duties, customs fees and other taxes.

"Duty" as I understand it, is simply for a duty official to open an package and check for drugs, non-domestic invasive animal or plant species, or dangerous contraband, whereupon the package is re-sealed and re-injected into the shipping process.

Inspection costs like you're referring to would be covered by customs fees. These are generally a flat-rate, or rates based on large item value brackets. They generally constitute only a minor share of the total surcharge the recipient pays.
Import duties are a surcharge that a govt. can use to, as @MattKing indicates, try and enforce policy measures w.r.t. e.g. creating a level playing field for domestic and foreign producers (whether we should call this 'fairness' is a politically charged question!) These generally depend on item categories, with some types of products (or services) being exempt while others are taxed. The presently popular trade war tariffs we see all over the news are in this category.
Then there may be (usually will be) the possibility of additional taxes being levied, in particular VAT. This again is generally mainly intended to shield domestic producers/sellers from foreign competition to an extent. In this category, you generally see the same rules for the height of the levied taxes apply to imported as well as domestically traded goods, which is what sets this factor apart from the duties as discussed above.

 

[MattKing]

It's not so much about any real valuation of the lens as such. DHL won't inspect it to that level of detail. They will use standard item values for broader categories; your lens may have been categorized as a "precision optical item" or "camera equipment" and DHL would have a default value for that. That value won't relate to the actual item's original list price, current resale value etc. in any way. It's just an accounting 'reality'. This sort of problem can occur if the sender fails to declare the value properly, which is necessary in order to prevent the clearance office from having to do the valuation themselves, which will virtually always be to the disadvantage of the buyer.
One more thing to take into account, although it makes only a relatively small difference, is that the taxes may be calculated over the item price plus shipping cost.



That's very nice, but some of us (1) do want a certain piece of kit sometimes and (2) don't all live in a place with a large internal market (from a tax perspective). In those cases, imports are just a fact of life.

FWIW, that isn't what is supposed to happen.
The duty charged is supposed to be related to the fair market value of an item, sold/acquired at arms length, in the country it was acquired.
For that reason, technically, the amount you paid won't automatically be the value for duty.
However ......
As a matter of practicality, absent any other concerns, customs officials will usually rely on what appears to be a commercial invoice when levying duty, so a customs broker will normally present that invoice as confirmation of that value.
In times of yore, I actually worked as a Canadian Customs officer, and I did challenge the values shown on some invoices. And in more recent times, I have imported items and had the Canada Customs officer check my invoice amount against prevailing market values.
And yes, the value for duty does include shipping and other charges.