A NEW ISO 200 COLOR NEGATIVE FILM FROM ADOX

[AgX]

Anyway, they seem to have no trouble finding customers even at $20 per roll. I hope it's helping them prepare to make more color film in the future.

Keep in mind that this $20 is money Freestyle gets. The Fotoimpex price was and still is 10€ (without german VAT).


So one may contemplate on who is funded.

 

[Donald Qualls]

I don't know why, but psychologically, the difference between paying $15 and $20 is really big.

It's a psychological milestone, like gas passing $4 a gallon or rent creeping over $1000 a month (for whatever you live in). I has no economic meaning, it's just a round figure your brain can latch onto.

 

[Huss]

I think that it is a big leap from $15 to $20 though. And Freestyle is importing that film independently which is why their prices 'need' to be higher to make it worth their while

 

[Minolta93]

Keep in mind that this $20 is money Freestyle gets. The Fotoimpex price was and still is 10€ (without german VAT).


So one may contemplate on who is funded.

I actually would have bought from FotoImpex if it weren't for shipping complications. As far as I remember the shipping to the US would have been ridiculously expensive.

 

[AgX]

Yes, this has been discussed here in this thread.
My remark was just about hinting at this "funding" aspect, which, based on your post, could be misunderstood.

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

We are waiting for the Color Mission I film boxes to be produced and shipped. Unfortunately we had several delays in this (like others). Despite the fact that it is uneconomical for us to finish films into black canisters with a label manually while waiting for the boxes to arrive we did so with a limited amount and will keep doing so every week. However the biggest surprise to us was the demand for Color Film. Orders came in 100x more than expected (and we based the demand on comparable films sold @ comparable prices). Color Mission I will sell out much faster than expected. So we decided to launch Color Mission II "Helios" much earlier than originally planned. This film ist the first attempt to recreate Color Mission I. It is a simplyfied version with only 1/3rd of the emulsions/layers and a low speed. More info coming soon.

 

[AgX]

Despite the fact that it it uneconomical for us to finish films into black canisters with a label manually while waiting for the boxes to arrive we did so with a limited amount and will keep doing so every week.

Having printed cardboard boxes made and putting the canister into it is cheaper than having adhesive labels printed and stick them onto the canister instead?

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

Having printed cardboard boxes made and putting the canister into it is cheaper than having adhesive labels printed and stick them onto the canister instead?

Yes if you have already finished the film to be boxed....We have a new government now and the first thing they did was raising wages by law. Applying one sticker now costs us about 25 Cents in wages only plus the cost of the sticker. The cardboard is fitted by a machine. Costs are in the range of 0,1 cents plus the price for the box which is comparable to the sticker.

 

[AgX]

However the biggest surprise to us was the demand for Color Film. Orders came in 100x more than expected (and we based the demand on comparable films sold @ comparable prices). Color Mission I will sell out much faster than expected. So we decided to launch Color Mission II "Helios" much earlier than originally planned. This film ist the first attempt to recreate Color Mission I. It is a simplyfied version with only 1/3rd of the emulsions/layers and a low speed. More info coming soon.

I read this as single layers instead of triple layers.

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

I read this as single layers instead of triple layers.

Per color, yes plus filter layers.

 

[AgX]

Is there any deeper meaning behind "Helios"?
Ethereal colours?

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

Is there any deeper meaning behind "Helios"?
Ethereal colours?

Yes, you need a lot of light to expose all three layers so there better be "Helios" out

 

[bdial]

My first roll of Color Mission is off to a lab for processing. Anxiously awaiting the results.

 

[flavio81]

Yes, you need a lot of light to expose all three layers so there better be "Helios" out

Love this sense of humor!

 

[flavio81]

It is a simplyfied version with only 1/3rd of the emulsions/layers and a low speed. More info coming soon.

Well, if it has less layers, then it will probably be thinner, and thus the potential to be sharper or to have more resolution.

As long as it is ISO 25 or more, then alright!!

 

[Lachlan Young]

Well, if it has less layers, then it will probably be thinner, and thus the potential to be sharper or to have more resolution.

Not necessarily - you may end up with more turbidity from making layers thicker and fewer. On the other hand, technology like Ilford Delta uses suggests that the potential is there for making suitable latitude emulsions that can be coated in a single thin layer per colour - and Fuji's Epitaxial Sigma Crystal technology seems to possibly have been an attempt to apply similar approaches to colour materials to reduce the number of layers.

And I get the impression that ISO 25 might be on the high side.

 

[mshchem]

Black can with an orange cap please.

 

[AgX]

And I get the impression that ISO 25 might be on the high side.

At the moment a slow and at fast C-41 colour film are announced by the industry. This is something to look forward too.

 

[LeoniD]

Sooo, how many layers did Agfacolor Neu have? Since it was the first film of this type and since it had a very narrow exposure latitude, perhaps, it had one layer per color too?
I know that couplers are completely different and that Adox will try to recreate Color Mission I palette, but I'd love to see the color palette of the first chromogenic monopack film 'reincarnated' in C41. Maybe even sensibilisation  bugs  features of the green layer could be added too?

 

[AgX]

It took decades, before the industry started splitting colour layers into sub-layers.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Sooo, how many layers did Agfacolor Neu have? Since it was the first film of this type and since it had a very narrow exposure latitude, perhaps, it had one layer per color too?

Most colour materials (and especially those running on Fischer coupler technology) before slide/ curtain coating came into widespread use (1955-1980) were running at a layer per colour (because they could essentially only be coated at a layer per machine pass with dip coating - and slot die might have been 2-3 at most - more often possibly just one per pass) + filter layer + supercoat etc - so about 5-7 layers total. They also seem to have used much more polydisperse emulsions - which have strengths and weaknesses (read Ron's posts on emulsion system design in the emulsion making subforum) - and the 'very narrow exposure latitude' is really just a characterisation of pretty standard reversal film behaviour - which will have been far more important in an era when exposure meters (as we would understand them) were very new.

It took decades, before the industry started splitting colour layers into sub-layers.

I think it happened pretty steadily across the C-22/ E-4 to C-41/ E-6 era - C-22 Kodacolor seemingly being 9 layer (3x machine passes on slide/ curtain). Certain Kodak machines (pre Room 13) seem to have been able to be threaded up in specific ways for multipass coating for colour or for single pass coating for B&W.

 

[AgX]

It took 20 years already to arrive at the C-22 process.

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

Black can with an orange cap please.

That is our standard since about a year. Inside the box it will have this.

 

[LeoniD]

characterisation of pretty standard reversal film behaviour

Yes, but I've read that negative Agfacolor had narrow exposure latitude too. Idk how true that is

Room 13

What's that?

 

[Lachlan Young]

negative Agfacolor had narrow exposure latitude too.

I think it was largely cinema neg they were talking about - and in that regard, you end up being restricted by the curve character of the print material - and your latitude for good colour reproduction rather than just density. That said, modern professional colour neg is often classified in DX coding as +/-1 stop, while B&W is +3/-1 - and a contrasty material like Ektar is arguably tighter than that.

Room 13 and 14 were the generation of Kodak coating machines in Rochester that preceded B-38. According to Shanebrook, they achieved such high efficiency by the 1990s that they were able to deliver almost all camera film coating requirements for worldwide markets.