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Bob Carnie

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Originally I had selected Analog-only for viewing and during that time I was under the impression that the Hybrid and Digital posts were where the majority of the discussion was occurring. However, based on comments of others, I enabled all three categories and have been totally surprised how very few posts there are in the Digital and Hybrid categories.
No surprise to me, I always wanted hybrid topics here, they are some of the most interesting for me personally and where my learning curve has been for about 7 years, I suspect many will slowly gravitate to these areas when they start making hand crafted prints and decide that silver is only one of them.
 

Bob Carnie

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The rationale for absorbing APUG into Photrio was that it needed the digital side to "support it" so that it could survive. Photrio as surrogate mother to carry the ailing, demanding APUG fetus to full term. I'm compelled to predict then, based on low digital use, that a miscarriage fatal to mother and child is our fate. Of course we're probably still in the first trimester, so maybe thats premature.
The writing is on the wall, film , enlarger, print is dead, dead , dead, only to be seen in very few facilities that print for others.... Pt Pd, Gum, Carbon Wet Plate, on the other hand is really kicking ass in the market place and on gallery walls..... This site has probably the best resource for wet printing ANYWHERE and is a monster aid in those wanting to do alternative printing but are afraid, allergic , cannot afford darkrooms... sunlight , simple UV light, simple contact frames and one can do this work in any space.... What is NEEDED is a negative and in 2018 that would be a digital negative that thousands of workers are making now... APUG could have ignored this and kept it traditional film only, but I am glad that Sean started Photrio to accomodate those of us who do like hybrid methods. We lost most of the best workers here the last 8 years to FB Groups that are extremely active and inclusive. My hope is that this site stays inclusive to other methods and grows and we are able to mine the resources that are stored in the history here and some of the better workers come back and participate.
 

Bob Carnie

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Gee thanks for your insightful and gracious comment Ralph.
Yes I agree with Eric , this kind of response is exactly how this site is losing its way... I am really surprised with these kinds of comments coming from some of the long time members here.
 

AgX

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The writing is on the wall, film , enlarger, print is dead, dead , dead, only to be seen in very few facilities that print for others.... Pt Pd, Gum, Carbon Wet Plate, on the other hand is really kicking ass in the market place and on gallery walls..... This site has probably the best resource for wet printing ANYWHERE and is a monster aid in those wanting to do alternative printing but are afraid, allergic , cannot afford darkrooms... sunlight , simple UV light, simple contact frames and one can do this work in any space.... What is NEEDED is a negative and in 2018 that would be a digital negative that thousands of workers are making now... APUG could have ignored this and kept it traditional film only, but I am glad that Sean started Photrio to accomodate those of us who do like hybrid methods. We lost most of the best workers here the last 8 years to FB Groups that are extremely active and inclusive. My hope is that this site stays inclusive to other methods and grows and we are able to mine the resources that are stored in the history here and some of the better workers come back and participate.

What you call inclusive others may consider exclusive. To them.
 

removed account4

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eric and bob, thanks ! +1

What you call inclusive others may consider exclusive. To them.

LOL i know, and it is the strangest thing i have ever heard !
the idea of including other people is exclusive ?
 

faberryman

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What you call inclusive others may consider exclusive. To them.
That's what the Clint Eastwood character felt in Gran Torino when he yelled at the kids to "Get off my lawn." By the end of the movie, even he had come around. Maybe it will happen around here eventually. In the meantime, just check only the Analog box, and you can continue playing in your own sandbox.
 
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AgX

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LOL i know, and it is the strangest thing i have ever heard !
the idea of including other people is exclusive ?

I give an example: In a thread at lenght a reversal film is discussed. And the only use discussed is scanning. When saying that reversal films are designed for projection, one gets as reply something as "who is still projecting these days?".
This is excluding those who project.

And Bob just did something similar.
 

faberryman

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I give an example: In a thread at lenght a reversal film is discussed. And the only use discussed is scanning.
Well, I hope it was marked as Hybrid.
When saying that reversal films are designed for projection, one gets as reply something as "who is still projecting these days?".
This is excluding those who project.
No, it is a perfectly reasonable question. And no one is excluded from chiming in that they are still projecting.
And Bob just did something similar.
No he didn't.
 

Wayne

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eric and bob, thanks ! +1



LOL i know, and it is the strangest thing i have ever heard !
the idea of including other people is exclusive ?

Every one of the derisive comments in this thread have been aimed at analog users.
 

Wayne

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The writing is on the wall, film , enlarger, print is dead, dead , dead, only to be seen in very few facilities that print for others.... Pt Pd, Gum, Carbon Wet Plate, on the other hand is really kicking ass in the market place and on gallery walls..... This site has probably the best resource for wet printing ANYWHERE and is a monster aid in those wanting to do alternative printing but are afraid, allergic , cannot afford darkrooms... sunlight , simple UV light, simple contact frames and one can do this work in any space.... What is NEEDED is a negative and in 2018 that would be a digital negative that thousands of workers are making now... APUG could have ignored this and kept it traditional film only, but I am glad that Sean started Photrio to accomodate those of us who do like hybrid methods. We lost most of the best workers here the last 8 years to FB Groups that are extremely active and inclusive. My hope is that this site stays inclusive to other methods and grows and we are able to mine the resources that are stored in the history here and some of the better workers come back and participate.

I hope they come back too, but Facebook offers a different experience that this site doesn't so they may have left for more than one reason. I don't recall if I ever complained about the necessaity for the "trio" in Photrio, but I did argue that the analog side should retain the APUG identity. APUGgers are what made this site what it is, and apparently they are still what keeps it afloat even though we are now second class citizens to be mocked and ridiculed.
 

Sirius Glass

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Every one of the derisive comments in this thread have been aimed at analog users.

So I am not the only one noticing that. Does that mean that I should make derisive comments about them? After all I was not the one who went into their living rooms and crapped on their sofas.
 

Sirius Glass

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Please don't.

I was not going to. I was making a point that as in the past the same ones who bad mouthed analog are doing it again. They cannot stand it when the same is done to them.
 

Theo Sulphate

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To me, all forms of imaging have value - even such as solar prints / photograms. What gets tiresome is the "film is dead" chant, when clearly it is not and never will be. Niche perhaps, but not dead.
 

removed account4

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Every one of the derisive comments in this thread have been aimed at analog users.

not really ... but its too bad that folks who are "analog users" think this site is exclusive ... exclusive to whom i don't know
i thought it was exclusive to people who practices all sorts of different kinds of photography - cameraless, hybrid, digital and chemical based. maybe i am missing something ...

Niche perhaps, but not dead.

yes, i agree, niche, no not dead, its still got a pulse and hopefully sales of film, paper, chemicals tshirts and patches will indoctrinate some more
people who have money to spend and are under the age of 40.. !
 
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removedacct1

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I hope to god that none of the aspiring 20-something newcomers to film work read any of this sh*t, because they will RUN the other way. This is embarrassing. WTF indeed.
 

AgX

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not really ... but its too bad that folks who are "analog users" think this site is exclusive ... exclusive to whom i don't know.

It was exclusive in the beginning. And that was why I joined.
I have no problem of discussing the analog part with people who go the hybrid path. But I have difficulties with that the pure analog way is seen by quite some other members as a niche here, even in an analog thread. But as others have pointed at here, that is the way things evolve and I have to accept this.
 

faberryman

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It was exclusive in the beginning. And that was why I joined.
I have no problem of discussing the analog part with people who go the hybrid path. But I have difficulties with that the pure analog way is seen by quite some other members as a niche here, even in an analog thread. But as others have pointed at here, that is the way things evolve and I have to accept this.
Analog is a niche in photography, but is anything but a niche here. The overwhelming number of threads are analog. Each day there are 60-80 threads with new posts, and only a couple are hybrid or digital. I shoot film, have my own darkroom and regularly print gelatin silver. For the past few years, I have ventured into historical processes. In doing so, my tools have expanded to include digital capture and digital negatives, but they are not important in and of themselves. What is important to me is the final image and the craft involved in making it.
 
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Eric Rose

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"What is important to me is the final image and the craft involved in making it."

Amen brother!

I am SO FREAKING TIRED of all this whining from the analog only stalwarts. Didn't you learn how to get along with people when you were a toddler in the sandbox! No one is taking your toys away from you. No one is changing the colour of the sand.

I've got a LOT of digital knowledge I could share but am tired of getting attacked, even when shared in the digital/hybrid threads. No these people don't have the guts to whine and snivel in the open, just via PM.

And let's not hear anything more about the odd pollution of an analog only thread by the inadvertent inclusion of something relating to digital. Get over it! Don't let your panties get in such a knot!

Almost ready to pack it in, Eric
 
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Sirius Glass

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Eric, people are not attacked for sharing digital knowledge and techniques, rather for pontificating that film is dead and anti-analog blather.
 

removed account4

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It was exclusive in the beginning. And that was why I joined.
I have no problem of discussing the analog part with people who go the hybrid path. But I have difficulties with that the pure analog way is seen by quite some other members as a niche here, even in an analog thread. But as others have pointed at here, that is the way things evolve and I have to accept this.

yeah i know what you mean this place has "history" and all that
but it is all different now ... i'm consistantly amazed at how openly hostile
a handful of people are ... even when there are options to block out 2/3 of the site ... still cranky
oh well ... can't please everyone i guess >> SSDD
glad you're rolling with it !
 
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BrianShaw

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Here we go again. Oy veh.

We’re eating our own kind... cannibalism at its ugliest...
 
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