Polypan F

[Anon Ymous]

... There was a story that it was a cine print film. Maybe in this old thread, above. v.s.

It had cine perforation, so it sounds plausible.

 

[Gerald C Koch]

Thanks to you too pdeeh. I am a world away from my cache (in France) so cannot check the 2 cans I have but what Gerald says sounds about right. There was a story that it was a cine print film. Maybe in this old thread, above. v.s.

Cine films are usually not on a polyester base. In contrast with acetate films polyester ones do not tear and therefore can damage expensive equipment. In addition acetate film is easier to splice. With several solvents that film acts as its own glue. Polyester film must be spliced with a special tape since the polyester is not soluble in solvents. The tape splice can be seen when the film is projected.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Cine films are usually not on a polyester base. In contrast with acetate films polyester ones do not tear and therefore can damage expensive equipment. In addition acetate film is easier to splice. With several solvents that film acts as its own glue. Polyester film must be spliced with a special tape since the polyester is not soluble in solvents. The tape splice can be seen when the film is projected.

Cinema camera films are on triacetate, print films are generally polyester today, as are some of the intermediate materials. Polyester is apparently vastly better than triacetate for projection - more durable, less shedding etc, & in a projector if there's a jam, the bit stuck in the gate burns through in a matter of seconds anyway. As all distributed prints have to be assembled & disassembled before and after their run anyway (won't go through the post otherwise!), I'd suspect you'd have a hard time finding the joins on projected 35mm/ 65mm. That's all getting away from the likely case that Polypan is probably a cinema technical film of some sort - I'd not be surprised if Filmotec/ Orwo had some involvement in it, they've certainly got formulae for slow speed panchro films - one of the versions of Adox Pan 25 used their emulsion, contract coated at Forte (I think, could have been Efke).

 

[Gerald C Koch]

Like so many things it eventually comes down to money. Is it less costly to replace a damaged print or a damaged projector? A new print can be obtained in a day or so whereas a damaged projector can close a theater for days. Of course this is becoming increasingly moot since theaters are fast converting to digital projection.

 

[Gerald C Koch]

Thanks to you too pdeeh. I am a world away from my cache (in France) so cannot check the 2 cans I have but what Gerald says sounds about right. There was a story that it was a cine print film. Maybe in this old thread, above. v.s.

The problem with this story is that cine print film is very slow since it is exposed in a duplicating printer. ISO value would be in the single digits and not 50. Print film is also not panchromatic. It need be blue sensitive only. Adding sensitizers would only increase the cost.

An example would br Eastman 2366.

https://www.kodak.com/Kodak/uploadedfiles/motion/2366_TI0265.pdf

 

[twelvetone12]

When I worked in a cinema a few years ago all the prints we received were polyester. We "mounted" the rolls into the reels and spliced them with a Catozzo splicer and tape. The splices were almost invisible. The tape also permitted to un-mont the reels and rewind them into rolls.

 

[Harman Tech Service]

I have checked with the people in our company who know these things...
I can back up what Simon Galley said "way back when" earlier in this thread.
This product was not made by us as a whole or even in part eg. emulsion.
It is possible that the use of an Ilford Developer on the label and the name might have been attempt to associate it with us somehow or it might only be coincidence.
Regards,
David

 

[pentaxuser]

I have checked with the people in our company who know these things...
I can back up what Simon Galley said "way back when" earlier in this thread.
This product was not made by us as a whole or even in part eg. emulsion.
It is possible that the use of an Ilford Developer on the label and the name might have been attempt to associate it with us somehow or it might only be coincidence.
Regards,
David

Thanks for the reply, David. Those of us who were convinced by Simon Galley's 2012 response and the subsequent evidence will take this as the definitive position and it should be the end of the matter. However the "bee may not have left and indeed may never leave the bonnets" of those who are convinced that there is a form of conspiracy which seems to consist of "not lying while cleverly avoiding the whole truth"

A pity but that is their problem and not mine or yours

pentaxuser

 

[pdeeh]

those who are convinced that there is a form of conspiracy

Yeah you say that.
But when you're woke to the truth of so-called "Simon r galley" (which by the way is an exact anagram of "I am Cthulhu") being in reality an intergalactic space lizard controlling the EU ... Well, need i say more?

 

[trendland]

I have checked with the people in our company who know these things...
I can back up what Simon Galley said "way back when" earlier in this thread.
This product was not made by us as a whole or even in part eg. emulsion.
It is possible that the use of an Ilford Developer on the label and the name might have been attempt to associate it with us somehow or it might only be coincidence.
Regards,
David

Thank you much David for your paraphrased statement your college gave us in 2012.
As we all know Ilford has seen a couple of changes in their company history the last 2 decades. Also in the last couple of years Ilford /Harman was forced to reorganize the company again.
So as a result from this lots of employers
are gone. Some were retired between.
I realy see the problem to the recherch of production issues from the past.
And therefore thanks a lot twice.
And we should handle it as a fact (you stated this before) that Ilford did not manufactured PolipanF itself ( in a whole or in parts ).
We all can imagine, as you mentioned it too, that it might be (absolute obviously) a fact
that somebody in bw film business
want to attemp to associate PolipanF with Ilford.
The question therefore is : Have Ilford given licences to use the original PanF formulation ( modified ) to other companies in the past.
For example to manufacture copy film
on a very near PanF basis.
(We discused the differences from emulsion in concern of anti halation a.s.o. here adequately).
For example licences to the 2005 bunkrupt Agfa-Gevaert Leverkusen?
We all may have understanding if you are
not allowed to state because it could be
a classified issue.
But it could help to understand were the
origin of PolipanF is !

with regards

 

[Frank53]

Have Ilford given licences to use the original PanF formulation ( modified ) to other companies in the past.
For example to manufacture copy film
on a very near PanF basis.
(We discused the differences from emulsion in concern of anti halation a.s.o. here adequately).
For example licences to the 2005 bunkrupt Agfa-Gevaert Leverkusen?
We all may have understanding if you are
not allowed to state because it could be
a classified issue.

OMG!!!!!

Frank

 

[trendland]

OMG!!!!!

Frank

Let's at first wait for a statement of Ilford/Harman.
Perhaps they should fly the flag more now.!

with regards

 

[trendland]

OMG!!!!!

Frank

Company secret is a better term (than classified issue) - but it seams to be clear
what is meant.

with regards

 

[trendland]

I liked it, and it was a bargain, but it seems to have disappeared in bulk form; i think there was a thread this year which suggested that it had been the last frozen master roll of a no-longer manufactured product that was being sold off in bulk rolls. My memory might be faulty though,
if anyone really wants to try it there's a few short rolls - 7 or 12 metres - or 36-shot cassettes being sold on ebay at inflated prices

Yes you are right - it disapeared.
Sometimes there are offers on ebay but mostly they are old offers.
I realy would like to have only one roll
152m in addition - because of 100 (135-36) films per roll.
That should be enough to me.
The rest one could buy from Ilford/Harman but not 5 122ft rolls at ONE time (PanF+)......because of pricing I can't afford.And Fp4 isn't also soo bad in
comparision.
At least don't be affraid of conspariecy
therorys.I have no idea of such thinks.
I just would be glad if We All could know
what stuff it is exacly....!
To me it is PanF (not improved version)
like you bought till 1992? (before PanF+)
from emulsion in B - Quality (some ebay selled quantities may have seen bad storage conditions in addition)
with acetat basis (allways used to special
Rollei/Agfa stuff)
With "less anti halation properties" because a little anti halation is from the film itself.
To a pricing of 59 Cent / film !
Some films I loaded have only 20 frames
So they have total film coast to me of
37 Cent - and the therefore the quality is nice to me (to some photographic projects)
Best results are allway from bigger formats - notice here we look at 135 film.

with regards

 

[Lachlan Young]

One of the many things we have learnt in the last few years is that a great many voluble conspiracy theorists are nothing other than (currently) unindicted co-conspirators...

The more Trendland makes his baseless assertions about Polypan, the more I suspect him of trying to cover up something about his involvement in it to his personal or financial gain, while abusing Harman/ Ilford with screeds of arrant nonsense.

As for who could make a similar film - Filmotec has a number of duplicating emulsions in their cinema range for starters (offered either BH or KS perf), their predecessor Orwo made 25 & 50 speed emulsions & given that they may make the emulsion in one country to their recipe, then coat it in another (possibly Foma?), before finishing elsewhere, 'Made in the EU' seems a reasonable catch-all. Agfa Mortsel are another possible candidate, they used to make a significant portfolio of cinema lab & print films, they coat on polyester & have manufactured emulsions from their archive for coating elsewhere (for Maco/ Rollei I vaguely recall?)

 

[pentaxuser]

Yeah you say that.
But when you're woke to the truth of so-called "Simon r galley" (which by the way is an exact anagram of "I am Cthulhu") being in reality an intergalactic space lizard controlling the EU ... Well, need i say more?

That reminds me about a series on TV in the mid 80s where the people looked like normal human beings but were in fact alien lizards, intent on conquering the world, who revealed themselves as such by picking up white mice by their tails and sliding them down their throats with relish

I can't for the life of me remember its name. Pretty sure it was an American series. Anyone remember? The best we in the U.K. could do then was David Icke.

pentaxuser

 

[Truzi]

I think it was "V"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_(1984_TV_series)

 

[Gerald C Koch]

Let's at first wait for a statement of Ilford/Harman.
Perhaps they should fly the flag more now.!

with regards

Sometimes things get missed when browsing but post #82 is that statement.

 

[pentaxuser]

I think it was "V"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_(1984_TV_series)

Yes that was it. Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[pdeeh]

picking up white mice by their tails and sliding them down their throats with relish

I believe it wuz RATS, and they didn't have any relish, or any pickles or coleslaw or ketchup. Raw rat.

 

[pdeeh]

 

[pdeeh]

What is more, there is a whole secret episode that was suppressed because it contained the TRUTH about PolyPanF.
I can't tell you about it because I will be eliminated by the Illuminati and the Deep State

 

[Harman Tech Service]

Have Ilford given licences to use the original PanF formulation ( modified ) to other companies in the past.
For example to manufacture copy film on a very near PanF basis.

I'm not aware of us ever having done that, my earlier statement can be taken to exclude this as well.
- David

 

[trendland]

I'm not aware of us ever having done that, my earlier statement can be taken to exclude this as well.
- David

Thanks - nice to hear David......

with regards

 

[trendland]

Sometimes things get missed when browsing but post #82 is that statement.

Just remember statements from volkswagen.....
"Everything you need to now aboud clean diesel technology.........."

with regards