Tariffs and Film and Paper prices

[BrianShaw]

Yes and on that basis shouldn't the discussion revolve around the effect of tariffs on such goods used by the analogue photography industry and its affect on that industry that alone. As Brian had said it may be the big ticket items that will affect us more as consumers but unless those items are photography related then the discussion becomes a soapbox item and lands in jail or a place where a lock is used

pentaxuser

I failed to add camera bodies and lenses to my list of “big ticket” items. Im balking at purchases of camera gear priced above 200 USD no matter how much I want it. I suppose it doesn’t take too many rolls of film to get to that criteria either.

How about that… rescued myself from the chance of ending up in a Photrio prison.

 

[ChrisGalway]

The discussion as I read it for the most part focuses on photo-related goods and industries. It is of course one of those topics that easily strays into territory we'd rather not venture, but so far, I'd say it's doing OK.

I buy a lot of photo accessories from China on AliExpress. No extra taxes (VAT is not an extra tax, I have to pay it on almost everything I buy anyway, except food) and innovative products (e.g. amazing AR glasses for stereo viewing, neat tiny light meters, much much more), the only downside is the delivery time, but even that is down to around 2 weeks now.

 

[GregY]

I am thinking more of people who order something online from a maker or shop abroad, as has become so common with the internet. For example, ordering some clothing, furnishing, tools, or equipment where the value is within the de minimis range.

bfilm i just bought a tripod head on Ebay from the usa. It goes through ebay global to the cnd border then DHL. So i just paid DHL $12 for them to collect the $6 tax due to the government on an $85 tripod head. End users in the usa will be paying more %wise to import small shipments themselves. Shipping charges & service charges alone will make sure of that...
When we think about dimensional measurements of paper for example...shipping costs alone become astronomical i.e. for 16x20 or 20x24" paper....

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Photo prices already vary widely from country to country. For example, a Japanese camera sold in B&H in NYC for $1000 sells for, let's say, $1300 or $1400 in England due to higher tariffs and taxes added by Great Britain. The EU is similar Many visitors come from Europe to vacation in the USA and load up on camera equipment for their trip back. If tariffs are added by the US to these Japanese and Chinese goods, then it won't be so advantageous any longer to shop in America.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Another factor is the exchange rate. That too is under discussion for manipulation; but in that case, schemes are not so simple to implement. And it all gets pretty confusing if one is surfing EBay comparing equipment prices, which tend to be baited pretty high at the moment, whether the fish are biting or not.

 

[bfilm]

i just bought a tripod head on Ebay from the usa. It goes through ebay global to the cnd border then DHL. So i just paid DHL $12 for them to collect the $6 tax due to the government on an $85 tripod head. End users in the usa will be paying more %wise to import small shipments themselves. Shipping charges & service charges alone will make sure of that...
When we think about dimensional measurements of paper for example...shipping costs alone become astronomical i.e. for 16x20 or 20x24" paper....

As far as small shipments to the US, this will depend on what happens with the $800 de minimis rule. As mentioned before, there are usually not any additional customs fees or duty or taxes for shipments that fall within this rule. It might be different for other countries. It is possible that shipping fees could increase, in general, though, if the shipping companies have more paperwork or steps to process shipments to show that no additional duty should be owed.

 

[GregY]

As far as small shipments to the US, this will depend on what happens with the $800 de minimis rule. As mentioned before, there are usually not any additional customs fees or duty or taxes for shipments that fall within this rule. It might be different for other countries. It is possible that shipping fees could increase, in general, though, if the shipping companies have more paperwork or steps to process shipments to show that no additional duty should be owed.

Many states and provinces have sales tax....it is not duty.... but it is owed on imports too...

 

[bfilm]

Many states and provinces have sales tax....it is not duty.... but it is owed on imports too...

In the US, private individuals do not usually make sales tax payments directly to the state. This tax is collected and paid by businesses that owe sales tax in the state. It varies by state, the threshold at which a seller outside the state would be expected to be responsible for sales tax in that particular state. So, if you weren't charged sales tax at the time of purchase, it is unlikely you are going to have to pay it.

 

[GregY]

In the US, private individuals do not usually make sales tax payments directly to the state. This tax is collected and paid by businesses that owe sales tax in the state. It varies by state, the threshold at which a seller outside the state would be expected to be responsible for sales tax in that particular state. So, if you weren't charged sales tax at the time of purchase, it is unlikely you are going to have to pay it.

To swing the discussion back around to the OP's post..... is there any scenario where you can see film & paper being imported by an individual coming out to less $$......than people are paying now?

 

[BobUK]

Agreed....& paper is already expensive. As a professional the client base shrinks when you price a mounted print at $1000 (+/-) when the cost of a box of paper alone is $750+ USD....

With prices like that it wont be long before the Customs and Revenue folk are patting themselves on the back after seizing another smuggled shipment of Bromide paper and film.

 

[Don_ih]

In my opinion, the price of paper is currently too high for someone to learn how to use an enlarger. Even when you know how to do it, a lot of paper is wasted. Forget about learning unless you have money to burn.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

The US has been participating in free trade for more than three decades. When it started, manufacturing of a wide variety of products moved offshore to places with lower labor cost and looser environmental/labor regulations. It's taken that long to reach the situation we were in at the end of 2024. Even if one believes that these arrangements are inappropriate, and that tariffs on film, paper, chemicals, cameras, darkroom equipment, etc. are the way to motivate US production of those products, suddenly imposing them on everything and at high levels is doomed to failure. It would require as many decades to , gradually, incrementally unwind things as it did to establish them as the current norm.

Photographic equipment and materials are, despite what PHOTRIO members might believe, not "essentials." I suspect that, given what's happening, there will be lots of carnage to this hobby, and it might not survive. There's nothing any of us in the US can do about it before November of next year.

 

[bfilm]

To swing the discussion back around to the OP's post..... is there any scenario where you can see film & paper being imported by an individual coming out to less $$......than people are paying now?

Well, that seems unlikely. But there is perhaps some hope that the cost will also not increase significantly. As far as individuals in the US are concerned, this will depend on what happens in regard to an across-the-board tariff on imports from Great Britain, Europe, and Japan. And on what happens with the $800 de minimis rule. And on what happens in regard to any tariffs that affect the price of the raw materials for Kodak.

 

[GregY]

With prices like that it wont be long before the Customs and Revenue folk are patting themselves on the back after seizing another smuggled shipment of Bromide paper and film.

 

[bfilm]

The US has been participating in free trade for more than three decades. When it started, manufacturing of a wide variety of products moved offshore to places with lower labor cost and looser environmental/labor regulations. It's taken that long to reach the situation we were in at the end of 2024. Even if one believes that these arrangements are inappropriate, and that tariffs on film, paper, chemicals, cameras, darkroom equipment, etc. are the way to motivate US production of those products, suddenly imposing them on everything and at high levels is doomed to failure. It would require as many decades to , gradually, incrementally unwind things as it did to establish them as the current norm.

But photographic equipment, film, paper, and chemicals is one of the few places where this has not happened. The majority of analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured in the United States, Great Britain, Europe, and Japan.

 

[GregY]

With prices like that it wont be long before the Customs and Revenue folk are patting themselves on the back after seizing another smuggled shipment of Bromide paper and film.

Well at 533 £ (20x24 /50 sheets) in London it's not far off the N American price....

 

[Truzi]

The US has been participating in free trade for more than three decades. When it started, manufacturing of a wide variety of products moved offshore to places with lower labor cost and looser environmental/labor regulations. It's taken that long to reach the situation we were in at the end of 2024. Even if one believes that these arrangements are inappropriate, and that tariffs on film, paper, chemicals, cameras, darkroom equipment, etc. are the way to motivate US production of those products, suddenly imposing them on everything and at high levels is doomed to failure. It would require as many decades to , gradually, incrementally unwind things as it did to establish them as the current norm.

I agree.

 

[GregY]

But photographic equipment, film, paper, and chemicals is one of the few places where this has not happened. The majority of analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured in the United States, Great Britain, Europe, and Japan.

But photographic equipment, film, paper, and chemicals is one of the few places where this has not happened. The majority of analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured in the United States, Great Britain, Europe, and Japan.

There is no black & white enlarging paper and no film cameras that I know of (besides small outfits like Ritter & KB Canham who build LF cameras in small numbers) or lenses being produced in the USA.... Can you name some?

 

[ChrisGalway]

With prices like that it wont be long before the Customs and Revenue folk are patting themselves on the back after seizing another smuggled shipment of Bromide paper and film.

And sniffing it as well !!!

 

[Sal Santamaura]

But photographic equipment, film, paper, and chemicals is one of the few places where this has not happened. The majority of analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured in the United States, Great Britain, Europe, and Japan.

Addressing the US, the UK, Europe and Japan as if they're one big, happy, free-trading, manufacturing family is inconsistent with the perception of those currently running the US government.

 

[bfilm]

There is no black & white enlarging paper and no film cameras that I know of (besides small outfits like Ritter & KB Canham who build LF cameras) or lenses produced in the USA.... Can you name some?

I don't think any single country produces everything necessary for analog photography. But what I mean is that this is one field that has not outsourced manufacturing to countries with little or no environmental regulation and low wages. Most of the analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured by the traditional companies in their longtime locations.

 

[bfilm]

Addressing the US, the UK, Europe and Japan as if they're one big, happy, free-trading, manufacturing family is inconsistent with the perception of those currently running the US government.

I was referring to your suggestion that "manufacturing of a wide variety of products moved offshore to places with lower labor cost and looser environmental/labor regulations." This is certainly unfortunately true, but what I was saying is that analog photography is a rare field that has not outsourced manufacturing to countries with little or no environmental regulation and low wages. Most of the analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still manufactured by the traditional companies in their longtime locations.

 

[GregY]

I don't think any single country produces everything necessary for analog photography. But what I mean is that this is one field that has not outsourced manufacturing to countires with little or no environmental regulation and low wages. Most of the analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals is still manufactured by the traditional companies in their longtime locations.

But you've somehow side-stepped the point that Europe, Japan & China..... where much of the analog photo supplies are produced.... have recently been alienated by the USA....

 

[GregY]

Addressing the US, the UK, Europe and Japan as if they're one big, happy, free-trading, manufacturing family is inconsistent with the perception of those currently running the US government.

Nicely phrased Sal.

 

[bfilm]

But you've somehow side-stepped the point that Europe, Japan & China..... where much of the analog photo supplies are produced.... have recently been alienated by the USA....

I haven't side-stepped anything. I was simply stating that analog photography is one of the few fields that has not outsourced manufacturing to countries with little or no environmental regulations and low wages. Analog photography equipment, film, paper, and chemicals are still made by the same companies in the same places as they have been for many decades or even longer.