TDLC-102 developer (Bill Troop)

[Alan Johnson]

This one shot developer can give pictorial results with Adox CMS20 II or Spur Ultra R 800.
It is detailed in The Film Developing Cookbook 1998 p97 and in FDC 2020 p132.
In FDC 2020 p134 it is noted that HQMS might replace glycin.

I made and use a 10x concentrate:
Demin water 40C ...............800ml
Sodium Sulfite anh..............40g
Phenidone.............................2.5g..(dissolve in isopropanol)
Glycin......................................2.5g
Sodium Bicarbonate..........50g
Demin water to......................1L

Dilute 1+9 to make the working solution, pH ~9
Develop 30min 20C, agitate at start then every 3 min.
For shorter times use higher temperature:

Massive Dev Chart Film Development, Film Developing Database

www.digitaltruth.com

This is with a 5 element lens P&S camera on Spur Ultra R 800 at EI=25:

 

[loccdor]

Great results. Would it also work with Agfa Copex Rapid?

 

[Alan Johnson]

Almost certainly it would work but may need a change in development time.
Also I hope to try one of the Aviphot 80 derivatives later.

 

[Alan Johnson]

TDLC-102 works OK with Adox CMS20 II at EI=20 and some scanner reduction in contrast:

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Yes, I tested this developer with CMS-20. It did an admiral job, and knocked POTA out of the number one spot as a replacement developer for Adotech IV.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I tested CMS-20 at EI 14...

 

[Alan Johnson]

Since Adox HR-50 is not as contrasty as CMS-20 I developed it with agitation at 1 min intervals, not 3min, for a shorter time, also temperature adjustment as in post 1.However the reflection of sky on light surfaces still needed a reduction of contrast in scanning. The grain and resolution of fine detail are good for a 50 ISO film and HR-50 will suffice if CMS 20 is not available.
Here is a shot from a classic car show:



TDLC-102 contains glycin which has been reported to have similar properties to HQMS used in the proprietary Spur/Adox low contrast developers so I guess TDLC-102 is likely to be the best low contrast developer of all those listed in the Film Developing Cookbook.

 

[Alan Johnson]

With Adox CMS20 II at EI=20 there is less need for contrast reduction:

 

[Alan Johnson]

Can shoot Adox CMS20 II at EI =25 in a P&S camera using TDLC-102 but the depth of field is somewhat shallow:

 

[pentaxuser]

In FDC 2020 p134 it is noted that HQMS might replace glycin.

What is HQMS?

On searching around, Google referred me to threads here on Photrio and the bad news would seem to be that making this HQMS is very difficult but the good news is that Suvatlar sells it - whatever it is

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[MattKing]

"High Quality Metol Substitute" ?

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Didn't someone here do tests about HQMS? I think the HQ is Hydroquinone.... converted to HQMS? Don't remember clearly...

 

[Alan Johnson]

TDLC-102 formula was suggested by Bill Troop as a starting point but since it works, albeit rather slowly, I did not try to modify it.
It contains phenidone which, as sole developing agent, is believed to coat the grain surface with inert oxide, as in POTA, giving greatly reduced contrast and loss of emulsion speed.
To give better film speed the phenidone can be partly regenerated. If hydroquinone is used it is found to be too active, giving high contrast. OTOH, hydroquinone monosulfonate , HQMS, is a much weaker regenerator of phenidone that has been found to give better film speed and pictorial contrast. The msds of Adotech for example seems to suggest that a mix of hydroquinone and HQMS may be optimal.
From FDC 2020 p134 HQMS could replace glycin, which is also superadditive with phenidone and regenerates it.

 

[relistan]

Excellent results, @Alan Johnson

 

[Corn_Zhou]

Didn't someone here do tests about HQMS? I think the HQ is Hydroquinone.... converted to HQMS? Don't remember clearly...

I think it's Potassium Hydroquinone Monosulfate. It is less active than Hydroquinone thus producing lower contrast. Not sure how it works in TDLC-102 in place of Glycin as the latter is even less active.

 

[Alan Johnson]

I never found a publication directly comparing HQMS-K with glycin.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I think it's Potassium Hydroquinone Monosulfate. It is less active than Hydroquinone thus producing lower contrast. Not sure how it works in TDLC-102 in place of Glycin as the latter is even less active.

Thank you. Funny... all the years I've been farting around mixing up developers, it's my first time hearing about HQMS

 

[Alan Johnson]

TDLC-102 with glycin does not seem to produce "onion rings" in the sky like I found using H&W Control with hydroquinone.
The developing time 30m 20C is conveniently reduced to 18m 25 C using Adox CMS20 II EI=25:

 

[relistan]

TDLC-102 with glycin does not seem to produce "onion rings" in the sky like I found using H&W Control with hydroquinone.
The developing time 30m 20C is conveniently reduced to 18m 25 C using Adox CMS20 II EI=25:

Developers aside, @Alan Johnson , that is a gorgeous photo!

 

[Alan Johnson]

Adox CMS20 II was developed in TDLC-102 30m 20C, ag every 3 min.
Results were obtained with the scanner on auto except clipping of the black and white points was removed and a little sharpening added.



Adox HR-50 was exposed at EI=100 as my P&S camera defaulted to this.
It was also developed in TDLC-102 30m 20C, ag every 3min.



Both these films so developed gave negatives that looked as though they could be printed on silver gelatin paper.

 

[Corn_Zhou]

Adox CMS20 II was developed in TDLC-102 30m 20C, ag every 3 min.
Results were obtained with the scanner on auto except clipping of the black and white points was removed and a little sharpening added.



Adox HR-50 was exposed at EI=100 as my P&S camera defaulted to this.
It was also developed in TDLC-102 30m 20C, ag every 3min.



Both these films so developed gave negatives that looked as though they could be printed on silver gelatin paper.

Wow, the CMS20 shot is really a nice one.
Which EI did you shoot it at? Can you post the negative so that we can have a reference point?

 

[Alan Johnson]

I was lucky to get ideal conditions with sun and cloud, not too contrasty, easy to process.
Shot was on Adox CMS20 II at EI=20, Canon EOS 10, evaluative metering.
Phone pic of the negative is attached, it is actually less sepia than appears here.

 

[Corn_Zhou]

I was lucky to get ideal conditions with sun and cloud, not too contrasty, easy to process.
Shot was on Adox CMS20 II at EI=20, Canon EOS 10, evaluative metering.
Phone pic of the negative is attached, it is actually less sepia than appears here.

Really a great shot and nice negative. Thank you!

 

[Alan Johnson]

The Spur Ultra R 800 film is edge marked Spur Orthopan UR which film can be traced back to 2006. It is reported to be similar to Adox CMS 20 but on a thicker base and having slightly higher contrast.
Like the CMS 20 II , this Spur film performs well in TDLC-102 when using the same times:

 

[Corn_Zhou]

I have tried this formula, 30min at 20C and 18min at 27C gives a thin but detailed negative. I have tried CMS20 and Lucky KS132 microfilm with TDLC102 and it works quite nice
Here is the shots
Adox CMS20II-Nikon F100-TDLC102-1-29 by Kelvin Zhou, 於 Flickr
Lucky KS132-Nikon F80s-TDLC102-1-22 by Kelvin Zhou, 於 Flickr