What is the current state and future of film availability especially 35mm?

[pentaxuser]

There is no uncertainty. Acros II has been available without interruption. And the production is done in a cooperation of Fuji and Harman.

In my mind the uncertainty comes with no guarantee that Harman will continue to produce Acros for Fuji.

Is there any reason why Harman should not produce Acros II for Fuji if it contracts Harman to do so and at a price that meets Harman's requirement. It's no different to the uncertainty that surrounds any contract between 2 companies, is it? The same uncertainty might be said for Kentmere being made for Freestyle under the Arista brand

pentaxuser

 

[GaryFlorida]

What is background radiation? Could it penetrate a lead lined box?

 

[BillBaileyImages]

I think it depends to some extent on your geographic location and what kind of film you're looking for.

There's far less choice than 20 years ago. But more choice than 5 years ago.

Kodak are the main company actually manufacturing colour negative film and they seem to have sorted our their supply/demand problems. There now seems adequate supply of their consumer and pro C41 films. They also coat the Fuji branded 200 and 400 consumer films currently on the market and the Lomography 100, 400 and 800 C41 films. And they brought back Ektachrome 100. They also still offer Tri-X, TMAX 100, TMAX 400 and TMAX 3200 B&W films. Though these are more expensive than other brands in most locations.

FujiFilm are still making a lot of Instax and slide film. They don't appear to be manufacturing C41 film at the moment and it is unclear as to whether they'll resume. Some self appointed experts (and some dealers) like to trash Fuji but the basic fact is that Japanese corporate culture means they're not as open as Kodak. For B&W there's ACROS II which has some involvement from Harman (manufacturers of Ilford films).

Ilford still make everything they made 5 years ago and have added Ortho 80 in 35mm. So that's PanF, FP4+, HP5+, Ortho 80, Delta 100, Delta 400, Delta 3200, XP2 Super. These are usually significantly cheaper than Kodak's B&W films in most locations. The same company that makes Ilford films (Harman Technology) also makes the more budget conscious Kentmere 100 and 400 films. And the big news is that Harman recently added Phoenix 200 C41 colour film - though it is an experimental work in progress and doesn't always act like "normal" C41 film.

Foma are still offering Fomapan 100, 200 and 400 along with Ortho 400. These are cheaper than the bigger players' films and in general not quite as good but are used by many people (including myself) with success. Fomapan 200 is a bit more of a modern type of formulation while the others are traditional B&W films.

Film Ferrania has begun to rise from the ashes of the old Ferrania company and are currently offering P30 and P33 B&W films (80 and 160 ISO)

Other smaller companies such as Adox offer various films, Adox mostly coat their films themselves and are another small company absolutely committed to analogue photography.

And you'll find a number of companies offering Kodak motion picture film in 35mm cassettes, such as CIne Still and Candido. These can be of use, especially as Kodak Vision 3 500T makes a good tungsten balanced 800 speed colour negative film. THere are also various small companies repurposing Agfa aerial film as B&W camera film. There's nothing wrong with this film at all but be aware that some companies make out that it's a special product unique to them and charge a premium for exactly the same film as someone else.

Most of these films are also available in 120 too. Ilford/Kentmere/Harman - all products are in 135 and 120. Kodak offer their B&W, professional colour and Gold 200 in 120. The Lomography C41 120 films are almost certainly closely related to 90s Kodacolor. Fuji still offers their E6 film in 120 and ACROS II. Foma offers everything in 120. Ferrania have started P30 and possibly P33 in 120. Adox had some issues but I think they're able to offer 120 again.

Have I missed anyone?

I took a hiatus from film photography from 2007-2014 and was shocked at what happened to the film market in that time. But things are getting better. Hopefully prices have stabilised particularly as Kodak have increased production. The pandemic obviously caused a lot of problems for many industries not limited to the chemical and shipping industries which really affected film production and distribution.

An incredibly useful and complete post. Thank you!

 

[GaryFlorida]

An incredibly useful and complete post. Thank you!

The knowledge of some of the members on here is astounding plus their willingness to share it is much appreciated.

 

[BillBaileyImages]

Absolutely! At 79, I'm learning useful and needed information daily. Been shooting since 1954, and the gifted folks here on Photrio continue to bring significant smiles and "Aha " moments to this weathered brain-housing group (a vestige phrase from my Triumph Trident days 🫠). Any Triumph devotés on today?

 

[Paul Howell]

You can easily get Bergger Pancro 400 in the US by buying from Blue Moon Camera. The seem to always have stock of it in 35mm and 120. Not sheet film.

I have not checked Blue Moon, will check it out for 120, but I was more interested in 4X5

 

[koraks]

What is background radiation? Could it penetrate a lead lined box?

Background radiation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Unless you have something like a deep salt mine to store your film in, you'll have to accept that it'll fog with age due to background radiation. Best not worry about it too much and use up your 400 and faster film before it expires.

 

[Paul Howell]

Is there any reason why Harman should not produce Acros II for Fuji if it contracts Harman to do so and at a price that meets Harman's requirement. It's no different to the uncertainty that surrounds any contract between 2 companies, is it? The same uncertainty might be said for Kentmere being made for Freestyle under the Arista brand

pentaxuser

Harman decides that make more Iflord or Kentmere films, which may have a larger profit margin. Fuji decides that it does not want to spend the time and effort to ship the emulsion to the U.K.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

What about chemistry? Still available and going to be available for reasonable money?

Chemistry is relatively simple, esp. B&W, since most/all ingredients also have other uses in industry

As koraks mentioned, B&W chemistry will never be a problem. You could develop all your films with D-23, needing only metol and sodium sulfite. Add hydroquinone and borax and you essentially have the means to brew your own ID-11. Add sodium carbonate and potassium bromide to your chemistry cupboard and you can make D-72—essentially Dektol—for your prints. Stop and fix for B&W film and paper are also easy to home brew.

Depending on where you are—I've presumed Venice, Florida, and not Venice, California, nor Venice, Italy—all these chemicals are pretty cheap and easy to acquire.

 

[Paul Howell]

As long as there is film there will chemistry. As noted above mixing is not too difficulty and there are providers who make make a diverse line of products, black chemistry just being one. The long term issue for 35mm and MF film is that without new cameras being made it will be harder and more expensive to start. In my area the local high school stopped teaching analog photography due to lack of reliable cameras.

 

[GregY]

As long as there is film there will chemistry. As noted above mixing is not too difficulty and there are providers who make make a diverse line of products, black chemistry just being one. The long term issue for 35mm and MF film is that without new cameras being made it will be harder and more expensive to start. In my area the local high school stopped teaching analog photography due to lack of reliable cameras.

Paul, there are lots of reliable cameras. I think if there are new models that will make film photography more expensive.... Look at the new Pentax 17 for $500 USD. Here in the Canadian Rockies there used to be a programme run by Craig Richards of the Whyte Museum.... "Through The Lens" for high school students...... people donated cameras to the programme.

 

[Paul Howell]

The supply of used gear is diminishing. With a few expectations like the Nikon F6 and Canon EOS IV which were produced until recently, or made from parts on hand, most 35mm cameras are now 20 years and older. My Minolta 9 was made in 1998, 800sim 1997 9X11992 Konicas date to 70s, my Nikon F, 1962, other 1973, and so and so on. Cameras are being tossed out, become broken, the supply is not unlimited. How many schools will take the time and make the effort to set up a donation program? Mint and Pentax are our best hope for new film cameras.

 

[GregY]

GaryFL to address your question i think we're in pretty good shape. Especially for B&W choose an emulsion , buy a bunch and stick to it. Decades of photojournalists lived off Tri-X. Kodak and Ilford are in pretty good shape. There are both retail and wholesale suppliers for chemistry. Find something that suits your shooting style and stock up. Welcome back!

 

[Pieter12]

The supply of used gear is diminishing. With a few expectations like the Nikon F6 and Canon EOS IV which were produced until recently, or made from parts on hand, most 35mm cameras are now 20 years and older. My Minolta 9 was made in 1998, 800sim 1997 9X11992 Konicas date to 70s, my Nikon F, 1962, other 1973, and so and so on. Cameras are being tossed out, become broken, the supply is not unlimited. How many schools will take the time and make the effort to set up a donation program? Mint and Pentax are our best hope for new film cameras.

Leica still makes film cameras.

 

[Paul Howell]

Not that most entry level photographers can afford.

 

[abruzzi]

I have not checked Blue Moon, will check it out for 120, but I was more interested in 4X5

My box of 4x5 is running low, I have a full box of 5x7 and no 8x10, so I recently bugged Blue Moon to bug Bergger for some sheet sizes. But at least it still exists in 120.

 

[GaryFlorida]

GaryFL to address your question i think we're in pretty good shape. Especially for B&W choose an emulsion , buy a bunch and stick to it. Decades of photojournalists lived off Tri-X. Kodak and Ilford are in pretty good shape. There are both retail and wholesale suppliers for chemistry. Find something that suits your shooting style and stock up. Welcome back!

Thanks. I was shooting Ilford B&W with Ilford chemicals. How are they price wise compared to Tri X?

 

[Pieter12]

Not that most entry level photographers can afford.

The Nikon F6 was mentioned. I did not think this discussion was about entry level photography, rather the continued supply of a variety of film. My limited experience with entry level photographers is the novelty wears off after a year or so, the continuing need for film is mostly for more experienced practitioners.

 

[Agulliver]

Harman decides that make more Iflord or Kentmere films, which may have a larger profit margin. Fuji decides that it does not want to spend the time and effort to ship the emulsion to the U.K.

There will be a contract between the two entities, which will have a stated duration with some expectation as to what happens after the contract expires. Breaking that contract early will result in quite substantial financial penalties for which ever party decides to do so.....so fujiFilm are not likely to suddenly decide they want to stop ACROS II, especially since they are already distributing Instax, and the colour films via the exact same channels.

Now, none of us knows the terms of the contract. It might be 3 years. Might be more. Might have options on either side after that. What you can absolutely bet your house on is that Harman, being the experienced and sensible folk they are, will be prepared to continue the arrangement or end it as per Fuji's preference when the contract is finished.

None of this affects Harman. They'll keep trucking along. ACROS is a very small part of their business. But one which some photographers value highly enough for Fuji to figure out how to keep it going after they stopped manufacturing it in-house.

 

[Film-Niko]

Harman decides that make more Iflord or Kentmere films, which may have a larger profit margin.

You can bet that Harman has a very attractive profit margin doing parts of the production of Acros II for Fujifilm. Otherwise they would not do it. And that is also the reason for Acros' higher price compared to Delta 100 for example.
My favourite film supplier told me the next fresh production run of Acros II is on the way.

Fuji decides that it does not want to spend the time and effort to ship the emulsion to the U.K.

Emulsion is in a solid state at room temperature (it must be heated to get into liquid form before coating). It can be shipped extremely easily at minimal costs. That isn't a problem at all.

 

[Film-Niko]

In my area the local high school stopped teaching analog photography due to lack of reliable cameras.

That is a very lame excuse. Because there are so many camera and camera repair shops which offer checked and / or repaired cameras even with a guarantee.
We don't have a lack of working film cameras in the market.

 

[loccdor]

why do people prefer to buy expired film when they can buy readily avalable new film?

Many reasons, for example you can't buy 400 speed slide film anymore, but I was able to find some frozen Sensia 400 that shoots like new. New films may have a color palette or contrast curve they don't prefer compared to old stuff. Color infrared sells for hundreds of dollars expired because it isn't made anymore. New Kodak films being made today are sometimes lower resolution than their older stuff.

Some people prefer the degraded look damaged film imparts as part of their artistic expression. Others like film history or simply trying things they haven't tried before.

 

[Hassasin]

Fujifilm is regularly advertising Acros II on their instagram account. They certainly wouldn't do that if they have intentions to stop it.
And as they are distributng all their instax films, their positive films, new Fujifilm 200 and 400 by the same own distribution channel, there are no significant additional costs by Acros II.

If history has anything to say on this, Fuji is the most unreliable on any future predictions. They put out Acros at an outrageous price and cashing in on it. Not much change in management is needed to pull that plug though. In fact they've pulled films from market on very short notice, they've re-introduced some on similar short notice. I would not count on any film product Fuji makes long term, sadly.

The only players that, at least for now, are future proof in film production are Ilford and Adox (all other brands I'll leave to that audience). Kodak is likely to continue, so long as Tarantino and few others keep ordering film. Once Hollywood drops out of film use, anything can happen to any Kodak film.

What can save it all, and also improve supply and choice, is demand. I'm not sold current trend is future proof though. There is a major generational change coming in a decade. Those in their 40's need to start taking film seriously and show to those in their 30's, so those can shoot the word down to those in their 20's.

Look at the generation Z? I have no numbers, but I see nothing in film interest that would be sustaining demand needed to make film. Seems like drop in the ocean. Phones have so much to offer these days in photography, even digital cameras may have their coffins in sight, at least the consumer level ones.

 

[JParker]

If history has anything to say on this, Fuji is the most unreliable on any future predictions.

End of last year Fujifilm officially announced a huge 30 million $ investment in their instax film production. That is much more than any other film manufacturer is investing. Fujifilm explained that this investment is so fundamental that the implementation needs time and is going on including 2024 and 2025. It is possible that by this investment the general film production capacity at Fujifilm is so increased that a resurgence of their non-instant film production is possible as well. We have to wait and see. In 2026 / 27 we will probably know.

 

[Hassasin]

End of last year Fujifilm officially announced a huge 30 million $ investment in their instax film production. That is much more than any other film manufacturer is investing. Fujifilm explained that this investment is so fundamental that the implementation needs time and is going on including 2024 and 2025. It is possible that by this investment the general film production capacity at Fujifilm is so increased that a resurgence of their non-instant film production is possible as well. We have to wait and see. In 2026 / 27 we will probably know.

Instax is not film in the context of this thread at least..