I wish to buy a Hasselblad clone , especially Kive 80, 88 they are the clones of it. Any comments on them ? Or should I just save my move to Pentagon Six or Bronica S/S2/D or else? I won't buy Hass just because I would like to experience the taste of USSR .
Any comment on Kiev 80 or 88 ?
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My friend had a Kiev 88 that I tried. It was terrible compared to my Mamiya RB67. Very unsharp photos.
My RB67 is 6x7. I don't recall whether the Kiev is 6x7 or 6x6.
I was given an 80 with 3 lens, two of the lens did not work, the back had light leaks, and the focal plane shutters were off. I just gave it away to someone who said they have it serviced. I know there are some that have rebuilt in Kiev that users really like, the lens are cheap, but for the money I would get a Bronica.
Do a search on Photrio on this topic, as it has been discussed/debated many times before.
I have several Kiev 88's and like them for what they are, but they are not for everyone. You have to want to work with within their quirky nature to get good results. If you want a camera you can beat-up and neglect, don't bother.
I've had my copies serviced by Arax in Ukraine. Like any mechanical camera, if you want them to work properly, you have to have them serviced at least once to know their full potential.
| Kievaholic Klub - The place for Kiev lovers everywhere |
Home of the Kiev FAQ. Also a source of information on these temperamental but fun to use cameras, including how-to's and do-it-yourself fixes for common problems.
www.kievaholic.com
A good source for information if you don't already know...
I have a Kiev-88 with 2 Hasselblad 1000F/1600F lenses. It's a finicky camera with a long list of critical "don'ts". Get one from Hartblei or Arax with a warranty. Mine had to go back twice (shutter, winding and back problems). I got it purely to use the Kodak Ektar 80mm.
I also also briefly had a Kiev-60. I believe they are much more reliable but the ergonomics are poor.
I also also briefly had a Kiev-60. I believe they are much more reliable but the ergonomics are poor.
I always put black paper tape around the magazine join after retracting the light slide with my Kiev 88's. Solves the light leak issues and it doesn't bother me, as I am used to this practice, coming from shooting motion picture film. There, you always tape the magazines because you simply cannot afford a light leak that could cost a day of shooting with crew and actors.
Only takes a second and, if you use a good quality black paper camera tape, does no harm to the camera.
Only takes a second and, if you use a good quality black paper camera tape, does no harm to the camera.
I have several of these and I like them. I think they are not as bad as many say, Kiev-bashing by people who nevr owned one is quite common. I have made a page for further information https://www.oddcameras.com/kiev_88.htm
The Kiev 80 for the foreign market (Salyut-C for the Soviet domestic market) is statistically the worst. The 88 is a little better.
Indeed, even if the oldest of all, perhaps the best built is the ancestor Salyut (smooth); as well as being sophisticatedly elegant.
I own both Salyut and Kiev 88 in perfect working order. The classic loss of light in warehouses is resolved with the replacement of the light traps/light seals. Easy operation and low cost of traps (Ebay).
Note that the bayonet of the Salyut (smooth) is unique and different from that of the Kiev 88/Salyut-C/Kiev 80. There are only 3 lenses for this bayonet: the classic and high-performance Industar 29 (80mm), the large Mir 3 (65mm) and the rare and mammoth Tair 3 (300mm). All very good.
On the contrary, the range of objectives for the more recent Kiev 80/88/Salyut-C is wide.
Beware of the Cyrillic suffixes after the initials of the lenses !!! Those with the letter "B" are for the 80/88/Salyut-C, those with the Cyrillic suffix "b" are for the compact Kiev 60/6C/Pentacon Six.
Example : Vega 28B is for Kiev 80/88/Salyu-C
Vega 28b is for Kiev 6C/60/Pentacon Six
Indeed, even if the oldest of all, perhaps the best built is the ancestor Salyut (smooth); as well as being sophisticatedly elegant.
I own both Salyut and Kiev 88 in perfect working order. The classic loss of light in warehouses is resolved with the replacement of the light traps/light seals. Easy operation and low cost of traps (Ebay).
Note that the bayonet of the Salyut (smooth) is unique and different from that of the Kiev 88/Salyut-C/Kiev 80. There are only 3 lenses for this bayonet: the classic and high-performance Industar 29 (80mm), the large Mir 3 (65mm) and the rare and mammoth Tair 3 (300mm). All very good.
On the contrary, the range of objectives for the more recent Kiev 80/88/Salyut-C is wide.
Beware of the Cyrillic suffixes after the initials of the lenses !!! Those with the letter "B" are for the 80/88/Salyut-C, those with the Cyrillic suffix "b" are for the compact Kiev 60/6C/Pentacon Six.
Example : Vega 28B is for Kiev 80/88/Salyu-C
Vega 28b is for Kiev 6C/60/Pentacon Six
Be careful not to confuse the Kiev 80 (same as Kiev 88 / Salyut-C) with the Zenith 80 !!
The rare Zenith 80 is the copy for export (English market) of the smooth chromed Salyut, progenitor of all the modular Kievs
The rare Zenith 80 is the copy for export (English market) of the smooth chromed Salyut, progenitor of all the modular Kievs
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I own a 1979 Salyut-S, and so far, I'm liking it. But it was broken when I got it, and I spent a number of hours learning how to repair it. I used good-quality new adhesives, lubricants and other materials sourced from USA, Switzerland and Japan. And the result is a camera which operates smoothly as you'd expect from a higher-end design.
My impression of Soviet cameras is that, perhaps when the factories were properly funded, quality could be very good. But in more difficult times, the factories devised "creative" solutions in order to meet their production quotas, and sometimes these solutions involved using older-style parts, or batches of parts which had previously been rejected.
Are you aware of any variation of mounts with the Zodiak 30mm lens?
I ask because I have what appears to be an original Zodiak-8V 3.5/30 Kiev-88, Salut-S Mount lens with the case and 3 rear mount filters in the lid, but the mirror of the Kiev 88 hits the filter when focused at "infinity! If you remove the filter, it just clears.
It is exactly like the one on the Arax page: https://araxfoto.com/lenses/arsat-fisheye/
Infinity is in quotes because you can't reach infinity with the lens mounted; it falls short.
I have also read in various forums that the rear filter is integral to obtaining infinity focus !?!?
Which leads me to believe there are variants of this lens with back-focus differences.
Any ideas?
I had a Kiev 60 for several years that worked well. I sold it to a cousin who also wanted to try out a Soviet camera. He has gotten a lot of good use out of it.
I still have a Pentacon Six TL made in East Germany that also works well if you keep the film tight when you load it. Otherwise it will overlap frames occasionally.
I have several Kiev 4 cameras that work relatively well. I think Soviet equipment works just fine if it was assembled properly in the first place, otherwise it can be gamble but there are technicians who can usually get them up and running.
I still have a Pentacon Six TL made in East Germany that also works well if you keep the film tight when you load it. Otherwise it will overlap frames occasionally.
I have several Kiev 4 cameras that work relatively well. I think Soviet equipment works just fine if it was assembled properly in the first place, otherwise it can be gamble but there are technicians who can usually get them up and running.
I can't help you. I have the Zodiak 8 but with a bayonet Kiev 60 (6C) ...
Mounted on these cameras it works very well; the filter does not interfere and focuses to infinity.
When using one of the colored filters, the neutral one must be removed.
I used it a few days ago on vacation
Kiev 60 / Zodiak 8 / Ferrania P30
Very nice photo! My lens came with 3 color filters and no clear filter. Does your clear filter have any appearance of being a diopter or is it simply clear glass?
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I never owned a Kiev, but I did own its direct ancestor, Hasselblad 1000. When that camera died an early death, a Hasselblad C was way beyond my budget until arrival of 2000FCM, I feel like Wotan awaiting its inevitable unrepairable breakdown of 2000.
There are other Soviet era cameras, Leica and Contax clones, that would be a better choice if you just want something from USSR era.
For 66, I would save my pennies for a Hassy, or second best, get a Bronica.
There are other Soviet era cameras, Leica and Contax clones, that would be a better choice if you just want something from USSR era.
For 66, I would save my pennies for a Hassy, or second best, get a Bronica.
The rear filter on the Zodiak/Arsat 30/3.5 fisheye is necessary to achieve infinity focus. Putting a rear filter behind a lens shifts the focal plane back by approximately 1/3 the thickness of the glass in the filter. The filters are just flat glass, no diopter.
If you don't have a clear rear filter, you can sort of bodge a replacement by fitting a small conventional filter (I think the size that would work is 37mm or 39mm) over the rear element and holding it in place somehow. I tried this and it works to achieve focus, but would need to be mounted carefully to avoid hitting the mirror. I don't know why your example has mechanical interference with the Kiev-88 (I have one in Kiev-60 mount and only tried it on a Kiev-60); perhaps the mirror position is just out of tolerance or someone messed with the lens somehow?
For the OP, understand that a Kiev-88 is a camera that looks like a Hasselblad, but not a Hasselblad clone. Personally, although I understand that people have made it work, I think a Kiev-60, Pentacon Six, or Bronica S/S2 would get one started with less aggravation.
Are you sure the transparent filter is missing? It is usually screwed in and apparently not noticeable.
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"" if you need to use one of the above filters, unscrew the COMPENSATION filter from the back of the lens, WHICH SHOULD ALWAYS BE FITTED, and install the filter you need." (quote)
I had a Kiev 60 which took beautiful sharp photos with the Arsat 80mm it came with. But it was heavy and always felt like it would break when I wound on. Picture spacing varied. The 6C (or 6S) is an earlier version with the shutter button the other side if I remember right.
More recently I had a Kiev 88 and an 88CM. The 88 has the foil shutters, screw mount, and despite it's decrepit cosmetic state it worked fine. The 88CM was one of the Hartblei reworked versions, cloth shutter, Pentacon 6 breech mount etc, and it worked very smoothly. I didn't like the film magazines with either (the old style backs seem easier to me than the new style). You have to be careful to wind on before changing shutter speed.
The lenses can be adapted to other mounts (eg Mamiya 645, M42, Sony E).
More recently I had a Kiev 88 and an 88CM. The 88 has the foil shutters, screw mount, and despite it's decrepit cosmetic state it worked fine. The 88CM was one of the Hartblei reworked versions, cloth shutter, Pentacon 6 breech mount etc, and it worked very smoothly. I didn't like the film magazines with either (the old style backs seem easier to me than the new style). You have to be careful to wind on before changing shutter speed.
The lenses can be adapted to other mounts (eg Mamiya 645, M42, Sony E).
I add one more very, very important thing !!!
When changing the shutter speed (after charging),
ALWAYS ACT CLOCKWISE (there is an arrow on the knob),
NEVER counterclockwise
I used professionally Salut, then Kiev-88 in 80-90th. Extremely bad mechanic is the main problem, not lenses. The only positive is the price & Arsat 30mm. Pentagon Six much better, I also had a full set with 5 lenses in early 2000.
With nowadays prices Bronica, Mamiya, Fuji are the better choice.
But of cause, the result depends not from your gear only
Here is the photo taken in 1981 with Russian TLR Liubitel costed about $10:
With nowadays prices Bronica, Mamiya, Fuji are the better choice.
But of cause, the result depends not from your gear only
Here is the photo taken in 1981 with Russian TLR Liubitel costed about $10:
Yes, I am sure. I went back and examined it; I am certain there is no clear rear filter on the lens. I just have the Yellow, Orange and Light Blue filters that are attached to the lens case top.
I think I might have found the issue; the Yellow filter which I placed on the lens initially has some sort of malformed thread that does not allow it to fully seat. After carefully cleaning the threads of all three of the filters, the Light Blue filter fits the best and is almost flush with the end of the lens. The Yellow sits almost one full millimeter above where the blue filter sits.
I will probably remove the filter element from the yellow ring and move it to one of the other rings for now and then try to find a replacement clear filter in the 38x0.5mm size.
Many thanks to you both for the suggestions! It caused me to go back and look at the problem with a fresh set of eyes!
I will try a roll and see what transpires. The light blue (80A?) should be fine for either color or b&w until I can find another clear filter.
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